Introduction: Mu Yunqiu, associate professor of the Institute of History and Science and Culture of Shanghai Jiaotong University, and with the first dean of the institute and the lecturer of Jiaotong University, Jiang Xiaoyuan , he has previously sorted out the main "science fiction" and scientific exploration of extraterrestrial civilizations, and the relevant achievements were published recently. Observer.com popular science author Cen Shaoyu talked with two scholars about this new book "Exploration of extraterrestrial civilizations - From Science to Fantasy". In the first part of the dialogue published earlier, scholars talked about the "lunar civilization" from the great scientists Kepler and Herschel to the cosmic view of China and the West. This article will continue to explore the depths of the universe, from the "civil science" of the Mars canal, and talk about whether the " Big Bang Theory " is really "victory".
Observer Network: There is an interesting phenomenon about the exploration of extraterrestrial civilizations. The Lowell , which strongly advocates that there are canals on Mars, was built by oneself by himself. According to our current standards, it can be said to be a rich "civilian science". At that time, the threshold for planetary science was indeed not very high. But behind the misunderstanding of the "canal", is there a lack of training factors? Why did it happen to be the "civil science" that has become the main force in misreading scientific observation?
Jiang Xiaoyuan: can't say that either. Because at that time, the rich men were the directors of the observatory and they also spent money to hire astronomers to work. For example, Lowell and Flamarion, one in the Americas and the other in Europe, were observing themselves, but they also hired astronomers on their observatory.
The astronomy community disagrees with the results they observed at that time, saying that they are "wild fox Zen" and are just random things.
They organize and learn by themselves and run their own publications. These actions are the same. There is nothing in the orthodox astronomy community, but later the orthodox academic community accepted it.
Lowell's Mars map, picture source:Lowell Observatory
In fact, the local Orthodox Astronomical Society had not been established before them; before they opened a magazine, local Orthodox astronomers had never done it, they were the earliest.
Later, the Astronomer Society was established, wouldn’t astronomers still accept it? He allowed orthodox astronomers to join, and in the end everyone came. There is now an observatory in France called Flamarion Observatory, which is completely recognized.
It should be said that the problem caused by observation at that time has nothing to do with whether they are professional or not. Because in fact, as "civil science and technology", their observations have reached professional level.
Mu Yunqiu: The threshold at was indeed relatively low at that time. As long as you have money, build large astronomical observation instruments and keep watching.
Similar characters also include William Herschel , and later became much higher in the academic world than the two of them.
He originally played in the church, but he always had an astronomy complex. He married a rich wife in his fifties and spent a lot of money to build an observatory.
He is also very talented, able to polish his own telescope and also has the ability to explain theoretically. He is a folk science enthusiast, and the astronomy community did not accept him at first. Later, he used his telescope to find Uranus , and the astronomy community was convinced and accepted him.
William Herschel and her sister Caroline Herschel both became astronomers
Observer Network: In addition to being a "civilian science" background, he also has many science fiction works. Does his science fiction tendency have a negative impact on his scientific judgment on the "Mars Canal"?
we take him and Keplerby. When Kepler imagined the moon's surface, the "rings" of the craters did exist, and it was nothing more than interpreted as artificial structures or impact craters. But the canal that Flamarion mentioned does not really exist.
Mu Yunqiu: There is a psychological problem here. In fact, it might be more appropriate to explain Lowell's example. Flamarion was the same routine as him. They were able to establish a reputation at that time by looking at the canals on Mars.Later, he took a very extreme direction, whoever uses his telescope to claim that he sees more canals will "win".
I mentioned in the book that Lovell has an assistant called Douglas Adams . For a while, Lovell was in poor health and went to rest, so he asked him to come out to take charge of the operation of the observatory. During his observation, he found that many of the results announced by Lowell were problematic, saying that he saw the canal somewhere on Mars, but Adams just couldn't see it.
Later, he wrote to a close friend of Lovell to talk about this matter, and the close friend told Lovell. Lovell was very angry and immediately fired Adams.
After the craze for Mars observations slowly faded, people determined that the Martian "canal" seen by these people was a visual illusion. When astronomers observe some things, you will be influenced by psychological tendencies. What you want to see is very likely to see.
Observers hope that there are intelligent creatures on Mars, and the canal is dug out by intelligent life, so they can "see" it. And Lowell hopes to see more canals too much in the competition, so he can "see" more.
Jiang Xiaoyuan: can also technically explain it. Kepler's imagination has been many years since Galileo pointed at the moon with a telescope. At that time, people had already seen things like the moon craters and the like.
Mars is farther from the earth, so there is still room for imagination, but the space for imagination of the moon has become smaller. Considering that Mars is old enough, there is also the possibility that a high-level civilization will appear and it will be annihilated again. Maybe something else is underground on Mars, and this kind of imagination still exists.
Mu Yunqiu: Like in the late 19th century, all the best telescopes in the world are aimed at Mars. But from a cultural perspective, Mars has never been lonely. Hollywood cute films of Martians.
Wells 's novel "World War" and Spielberg director and Tom Cruise starring
Observer Network: But should scientists' imagination also have certain self-discipline? For example, according to the personality and style of some scientists, they may imagine it after having relatively accurate observations, rather than directly saying it is a canal. Some people may be more conservative about observations that are not yet completely reliable. When you see a distant object that is almost straight, it may not be a canal, but it may also be a rift that happens to be straight. Will the descriptions of people who are more inclined to "science fiction" in their thinking be affected?
Jiang Xiaoyuan: It is very important to guide and the first person, it is the Italian astronomer Shapareli. After he misled it, everyone thought the idea of Mars Canal was good.
Mu Yunqiu:And he used an Italian word called canali (Observer Network Note: Italian canale plural is canali, which is similar to the canal in English. If translated into English, it has two meanings: one is a natural channel, and the other can correspond to the canal in English. When they arrived at the British, they chose to translate it into a canal. This is a psychological tendency and a guidance.
Observer Network: For human imagination, the solar system will soon be insufficient. In order to overcome the difficulties of interstellar navigation, it seems that science fiction has gone to the forefront of science. For example, the book mentions the movie "Contact" which gave birth to the wormhole theory, and "Star Trek" created warping flight. The related theories can basically remain self-consistent in questioning, but I think there are certain problems with this kind of self-consistent in mathematical solution. It does not mean that it exists in the real world, and it may not necessarily reflect the real universe. Will science become a "mathematical game" in these fields? Some criticisms of "string theory" are similar.
Judy FosterIn Contact
Jiang Xiaoyuan: I am willing to use the word "game".Although we always think that science always says that there is evidence that can be verified, etc., when we want to praise science or want to talk about science, such as using science to suppress you, we will indeed emphasize this part of science, but if you look carefully, there are many parts of science that cannot be verified and cannot be tested by practice. Of course, things like
wormholes have not been tested at this moment. We may be able to test some day in the future, but we don’t know. And there are some theories that can now rule out the possibility of being tested. For example, can you directly test theories like the first three minutes of the universe? You will never go back to that time, right?
Why do we still need to provide this theory of impossible testing in the palace of science?
In many pictures about the Big Bang theory, the first three minutes of the universe accounted for a large part of
Observer Network: But if its theoretical deduction cannot find any fault, can it be valid?
Jiang Xiaoyuan: If you are out of reality, if you want to say that there is nothing wrong with reasoning, there are endless things that can be found. But the scientific value of these things is indeed limited.
If we really must have a test, for example, we must really implement the set of popper to the end, and only if it is falsified, it will be admitted that it is science, then "string theory" and so on have long been driven out of the palace.
But in fact, we did not do that, but tolerated many very mysterious things in science.
In fact, we don’t know what the external world looks like. We have now drawn a picture to depict the external world. If you are willing to use it, then continue to use it, but don’t think it is a real phenomenon in the external world.
Humans have been drawing different pictures.
Observer Network: It can be said to be a psychological need of human beings, and everyone hopes to have an answer.
Jiang Xiaoyuan: The current picture can be said to be adopted by us at present. You can understand the external world like this, but this does not mean that other understandings are wrong.
For example, in the era without Einstein , the time and space of Newton was a "real" picture. Later, Einstein's theory of relativity came out, and the old picture was contained in the new picture. Similar situations have occurred countless times in the history of science and technology. Maybe 100 years later, maybe tomorrow, someone will propose a new theory, and the picture of the world will change again.
Mu Yunqiu: Wormholes and warp flights, you can find dozens or hundreds of papers online, and you can regard each paper as a picture describing them.
If someone really creates a wormhole or a warped flying machine in the end, then all other pictures will be over. But before this, these pictures were uncertain and everyone could do it.
Every year, the top physics journals receive a lot of submissions about the time machine, and usually treat it as the same as the perpetual motion machine , but why is the article of Thoren accepted?
, as I said just now, is theoretically valid, because it is calculated based on Einstein's general theory of relativity , so his manuscript was accepted.
Warp Flying in Star Trek
Jiang Xiaoyuan: But the verified picture may not necessarily completely exclude other pictures. For example, the Big Bang theory has now become mainstream because there are three major verifications: helium abundance, background radiation, and cosmic redshift. In the Big Bang theory, it predicted these three things, and now you have observed them, so it has become mainstream. But the problem is that if you construct another picture, you may also include these three pieces of evidence. The possibility of this theory appearing will always exist.
or another theory emerges. It does not have these three verifications, but there are other verifications, what if there are more than the three? Therefore, the "victory" of the Big Bang Theory now cannot rule out the appearance of other pictures, and there is no reason to think that it is a real phenomenon of the universe. These are constructed.
Observer Network: The book also mentioned that in 1996, warpage flight was included in the "Breakthrough Propulsion Physics" (BPP) program by NASA, and was stopped six years later. Is this a waste of funds?
Mu Yunqiu: is more a fraud than a waste.
Jiang Xiaoyuan: is based on NASA's position. It is upright and has a clear conscience. It says that if you want to develop science, you need money. Is it wrong to fight for more money?
Mu Yunqiu: NASA officials said nakedly to the funded scientists that they didn't care about researching on what journals to publish, such as Nature, Science, etc. What they care about is whether research can often make a noise in the media, whether media reports on your research, which directly concerns whether you can continue to receive the next funding.
Observer Network: Members of Congress must also be able to understand. They probably can't understand Nature and Science, they can only understand CNN and " New York Times ".
Jiang Xiaoyuan: Just let them feel understanding...
(To be continued)
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